The Career Flipper Podcast

From Guest Experience Manager with Cirque du Soleil to Ghostwriter, meet Carolene Méli

Episode Summary

From Guest Experience Manager with Cirque du Soleil to Ghostwriter, meet Carolene Méli in Paphos, Cyprus

Episode Notes

Episode Transcription

Carolene 00:00:00  Each opportunity that you go into. Learn as much as you can, because whether you realize it or not, it will help you in the next one.

Jenny 00:00:08  Welcome to the career flipper. I'm Jenny Dempsey, furniture flipper podcast host and someone who knows firsthand how messy and emotional career changes can get. This show was born out of one of those. What the heck am I doing now? Moments I got laid off from my customer experience job and suddenly I couldn't find a new job. Two years and 400 job applications later, I was still hearing thanks, but no thanks. So I got scrappy. I grabbed some junk furniture and taught myself how to use an orbital sander, and I started flipping furniture pieces in my garage to keep them out of the landfill and make some extra cash on the side. I was suddenly covered in paint, sawdust, and more than a little self-doubt. And just when I was starting to build my own thing. A corporate job landed in my lap and they actually said yes. I resisted.

Jenny 00:01:06  It wasn't the plan, but saying yes felt like the right move right now. A step on my path and financial stability became the investor. I needed to slowly and sustainably build the podcast and my furniture businesses on the side. And while I was rebuilding, I kept wondering, but how do other people do this? How do they figure out this career change even if they didn't necessarily ask for it? So I started to ask people about how they made these changes. And honestly, I'm learning so much. Each week I sit down with everyday real people who flip their careers, sometimes by choice, sometimes out of sheer necessity. Their stories are messy, honest, and full of the kind of hope that you might need to hear right now as you navigate your own career change. So if you've ever felt that itch to make a change, but you really have no clue what it might look like. You're not alone. And you're exactly hoping. Guest is Caroline Melly, who is currently a ghostwriter for live entertainment executives and someone whose career path has taken some seriously unexpected turns.

Jenny 00:02:18  She started out studying nutrition, but what followed was a 20 year adventure in the live entertainment industry. She spent 11 of those years as the guest experience manager of VIP experiences with Cirque du Soleil, traveling to 17 countries, managing six different shows and creating unforgettable moments behind the scenes for some of the world's most iconic performances. Then, like so many of us, the pandemic hit and everything changed. She opens up about the emotional roller coaster of losing a job she loved, becoming a solopreneur and facing the vulnerable moment of asking her parents for financial help. But her story doesn't end there. With the help of therapy community and a game changing ghostwriting mastermind, she found a new path, this time helping those high level execs in the entertainment world craft their voice and messaging online. So if you've ever had to rebuild from scratch, or wondered if it's possible to reinvent yourself after a big loss. Her story is full of honesty, hope, and resilience that just might spark your next big move. Let's get into the episode now.

Jenny 00:03:31  Hello! Welcome to the career flipper. I am so happy to have you here. Can you tell everybody a little bit about you?

Carolene 00:03:40  Yeah, sure. Hi. My name is Caroline Maley. I live on the beautiful island of Cyprus. Those that don't know have never heard of Cyprus. It's a little island, kind of below Turkey, below the Greek islands. and I've been here a few years, and originally I'm kind of from everywhere. I was born in New Zealand, raised in Australia, half French, and I'm just especially with my work, which we'll talk about in a second. I've been always on the move, so this is the first time in my life I have been in the one location for more than six months or so, and it's been a couple of years, so that's been quite the journey. But yes, that's that's where I kind of come from. And I am a ghost writer and I specifically ghost write for a live entertainment industry executives, helping them build their personal brands on LinkedIn and keynotes and beyond.

Carolene 00:04:33  So amazing work on an amazing, beautiful Mediterranean island. And yeah, that's where I'm at right now.

Jenny 00:04:40  That sounds like the dream right there. And three years there. What are just not to derail the conversation, but what is what are some of your favorite things about living in Cyprus after you've been there for a while now?

Carolene 00:04:55  Yeah, I mean the C is the, the biggest, the Mediterranean Sea. You could be anywhere in the Mediterranean and give the same answer. But the sea. Anyone listening that lives by the sea knows just how powerful that is for every aspect of your life, and bringing a positive influence. I would also say I just the Greek and Cypriot culture, I, I love it, it's a very ancient culture, right? the food's incredible. Cyprus is quite close to Turkey. So you also have Turkish influence. And in the food, that makes me very happy because it's my definitely my kind of food. And then I think, being in the Mediterranean, you can get around quite easily.

Carolene 00:05:39  I actually last week had to go meet a client in London, and the flight was €25, which in Europe. Yeah, $30, $35 or so. So it's cheap and quick to get around, especially in the south, the south of the Mediterranean. And so living here, it's just very cool to be able to just jump and jump around.

Jenny 00:06:00  Yeah. Oh, that sounds amazing. I love that. So you're living the dream in Cyprus and your ghostwriter. But now. How did you get to this point? How did you get here? Because your journey was far from traditional. I would say so. Can you share how your career flip kicked off?

Carolene 00:06:24  Yeah, I think it's multiple flips at this point, I don't think. But it's great to have this conversation now because actually in the last six months, it's come full circle. And now I'm writing for the industry, the leaders of the industry that I've actually been a part of for so long. So it's become quite meaningful. As a matter of fact.

Carolene 00:06:42  I started I mean, at university, I did nutrition dietetics, which didn't do a thing with, in the traditional educational sense, but I started doing lots of, you know, as everyone does bar, restaurant, event type work, throughout university and, and around that time when you're, when you're around 20 and I have the opportunity to Cirque du Soleil, which I'm sure a lot of your audience is familiar with the international company. Billion dollar company at this point. But they were performing in my hometown of Brisbane, Australia, and I got a job in the bar, like making hot dogs and popcorn and serving the guests of the show. And that began my love affair with Cirque du Soleil. And at the time, I was studying. So actually the way Cirque du Soleil works still to this day is every city that they go to with their show, with the Big Top, they hire about 200 locals to work, do the jobs that I, for example, that I just mentioned. So, it's a touring operation And so I did it in Brisbane and then I loved it.

Carolene 00:07:57  And then, I actually followed them and did a couple more cities and went back to university, finished my degree. Then they came back again a couple of years later. And it was a timing thing, but I, I started off doing the exact same thing, just working in the bar. And then I applied for a full time job that happened to be opening up, running the entire food and beverage operation as the manager. And I got it. And that was I was 2420, about 23, 24. And I was officially on tour with Cirque du Soleil, and we finished the Australian tour, and then it was straight over to Europe, and I did that in in total, not consecutively, but in total. I have toured with Cirque du Soleil for 11 years and just stopped, at the pandemic actually, when everything kind of shut down. So that was how things began, I guess. I guess you could say.

Jenny 00:08:53  Wow. So before that, had you traveled to Europe, or was this your first time traveling abroad? Away from home?

Carolene 00:09:02  Yes, I had.

Carolene 00:09:03  Neither of my parents are Australian, so my father's French, my mother's from New Zealand, so we grew up travelling and I had been to Europe before. Yes. So it wasn't like I'd never stepped outside of my little town. And off I went into the big wide world. I, you know, we we traveled ever since I can remember. So that was part of my growing up anyway. Yeah. but I was a gymnast when I was younger, so to be able to work for Cirque du Soleil in any capacity was like a really big deal. because of how obviously how well-known. Not in the world, but like, in the gymnastics world, they they were. They are. So that was a pretty amazing like I was on a highlight. That was the coolest job in the world. It still is. But at the time as a young 23 year old going through a full time with Cirque du Soleil. Was like, out of this world.

Jenny 00:09:57  Wow. Yeah. That's amazing. That's amazing.

Jenny 00:10:00  So you did this for 11 years and you traveled around. You were in Europe. Where else did you travel to while you were working with them?

Carolene 00:10:08  Yeah. I've done. I feel like I've spent probably over just over half of my time with them in Europe, but I also did Canada, America, Australasia, like Australia and New Zealand as well.

Jenny 00:10:22  That's amazing. So you're traveling around, you're doing this amazing work and you're in your early 20s. And when did things pivot for you? Because you said you left when things started to close down during the pandemic. And I'm curious about that time, because a lot of that, a lot of us didn't have a choice for certain careers. Things just closed. So what was that like for you when things started to shut down and suddenly everything that you knew in your career was changing?

Carolene 00:10:54  Yeah, it was shocking, I guess, as it was for most people, but I was already on my way out. Mentally, I'd been there for such a long time, I'd come and gone like I actually.

Carolene 00:11:05  Another part of my story is I got headhunted to run the entertainment department on a cruise ship, and I'd never stepped foot on a cruise ship, nor would I ever. As a traveler. It's not something that I'm personally interested in doing. And so when I got headhunted for this job, it was, I looked at the job description and I was like, I don't even know. But then I thought, you know what? This is kind of what I do at Cirque du Soleil, but let's replace the circus tent for a cruise ship. And that was the mentality I went in with. And and I did one season and, yeah, it was a great I wouldn't do it again, but it was an amazing experience. And now I can speak to a small part to the cruise industry, which helps me now in my, in my job as a ghostwriter. So I kind of came and went, did a bunch of different things. When the pandemic came around, I was already. I was done, like, I'd reach my.

Carolene 00:11:55  I wasn't growing. I wasn't, you know, I was getting a bit sick of of moving around. and I was not being challenged in any way, but. Plus, I didn't see a career path. I didn't there was nowhere for me to go in, in a direction that I actually wanted. Right? And so it forced me to it made the decision for me basically. and within a week. Yeah, 90, I think it was around 95% of the company, lost their jobs and the company lost their revenue. And, and I thought, right, this is my chance to, like, be a solopreneur and do that kind of thing. And if I was to sum up the next three years, it was the hardest thing I've ever done. And to the point where I, like, I went broke, super depressed, like it was. And part of that story was when I was here in Cyprus. But it was the most. Yeah. It really, really broke me going from being an employee my whole life.

Carolene 00:12:58  Right. So you have a very strong employee mindset, which I don't think you truly understand until you step out of that world. So anyone listening, if you if you've stepped out of that world and tried to go on your own, it clicks. But when you're an employee, it's it's hard to make that connection. But yeah, I, I tried everything and and it was quite hard for me because all the industries that I was expert in or maybe not expert, but that I worked in, that I loved work. All the industries that got demolished by the pandemic. You know, entertainment, events, travel, hospitality. It was actually very, very difficult. And I tried to do so many different things, and I did it a lot on my own, which is the number one thing that I would advise against. and everyone has that. But you don't you think you can do it right? I know I can do this on my own. and so yeah it actually and then it all came to a big like crash bang at one point, like I had to ask my parents to borrow money to pay.

Carolene 00:14:02  Like I'd gone through all my savings. Everything. You know, and as an adult to ask my parents in their 70s for that it that that was the tipping point. That just broke me. It was horrible. I was so ashamed. And and it was just, oh, and I'm lucky to have parents that are able to do that. and they were happy too, because they saw how hard I was working. But that was the moment I was like, I got to do something. So and and that kind of ends that chapter of, there's a saying by, someone that I follow online, and his name is Jake Molina, and he has this kind of he's he's coined this saying that says likes ain't cash And that pretty much sums up that entire journey, because I was getting so many compliments about all the stuff that I was doing and wow, this is amazing and you're amazing and all this. What an amazing service. But I couldn't get anyone to actually pay me money. And in hindsight, I was trying to get them to hire me again.

Carolene 00:15:07  Going back to that employee mindset. So now hindsight, I can say see all the things very clearly that I did wrong on that journey. But it was a very difficult, frustrating journey that I really ended up quite broken. And that was, two years ago. And that kind of came up to two years ago where the ghostwriting chapter began.

Jenny 00:15:29  Wow. Yeah. It is so hard to go out on your own. I complete like that resonates so much. And the things that you take for granted as an employee, you don't realize what it's like to not have them. And I think for both you and I, like, we didn't have a choice. Like I got laid off. You also lost your job. And so thinking of creative ways to still get business and make money can be very challenging. And so this was such a pivotal time for you. It sounds like and so incredibly hard emotionally, financially, business wise. And so I'm curious if I can if I can ask this and take a step back a bit, like what made you want to be a solopreneur in the first place? Did you see others that were doing it? Did you just feel like, well, I didn't have a choice because it sounds like it was something that you're like, well, this is the time to do it.

Jenny 00:16:21  But what made you want to actually pursue that in the first place?

Carolene 00:16:25  Yeah, I feel like ever since I was young, I've had this, I guess chip on my shoulder, if you want to call it that. But I was always the the kid that had so much potential. If only they. And then fill in the rest of that sentence, right? My parents, my teachers told my parents that in every parent teacher interview, my gymnastics coach told my parents, like that's that's been part of my identity since the beginning and something I'm not. Yeah, I feel like those are the kind of things you don't realize how much of an impact they have on you until you're, like, talking to a therapist or you're having a conversation with, like, a best friend or something, or, or it's showing up in an endeavor that you're trying to pursue. Right. And so that was, that's what I have come to the conclusion, like I've always been, that like, you have so much potential.

Carolene 00:17:18  And where in a lot of the jobs that I had, I felt like I never was reaching my full potential. I never, ever felt in any of my jobs that I was like, you know, I was doing a great job and I was a good leader. And obviously in a very unique environment where I was learning quickly, you know, doing the very similar thing in 17 different countries was the total number of countries and all of that time at Cirque du Soleil. And but that that's that's really I didn't I didn't want to finish my days being like still that same. She has so much potential. But and so I knew I always wanted to do something more. Even in my jobs, I was always creating a leadership program. If there wasn't one, or I was creating this and that and a little club, and I was always trying to do something to, to, to do better, I think like to do more and to do better. And so I think it was just a natural progression into, into creating something that didn't exist for me in, in the world of like work, if you want to call it that.

Carolene 00:18:19  So that's really was the driver behind. And then the pandemic was like, right, I'm giving you this opportunity go choice.

Jenny 00:18:30  So yeah, no, that makes sense. That makes sense. And so then you have this chance and you're like, well, I'm going to create it. Did you feel pretty confident? I'm guessing maybe you did because it sounds like a little bit of the story you did. But when that time period went, you're like, well, I don't got this job. This is my chance. I'm going to take it. Did you feel confident that you were like, yeah, it'll be fine. Or were there reservations at first?

Carolene 00:18:56  No, I feel like I've always been quite a confident person, and I also am very I know where my skills are, and I know I'm not sitting here thinking or I wasn't at the time thinking, oh, I don't know, like what my talents are and how I could, like, I know what I'm good at. I know and I know my strengths.

Carolene 00:19:17  And so I think having that as the foundation and it comes from I, I've brought it up a number of times, but doing, repeating the same operation in many different countries and cities. It's 17 countries. I tried to count the cities once and I couldn't, but it probably over 60 different cities around the world over that time. So it teaches you because you're doing the same operation, but in different with different cultures, with different languages, with different mindset of workers. That was just the most amazing university of of work and life, I think, and that that really brought me to the place where I could say that I was quite confident in my abilities. obviously I had no idea how to make money. I'd never done sales before. You know, I worked for companies that anyone would kill to be associated with. So when I needed something outside to solely if I wanted to do some kind of external deal, just the word Cirque du Soleil meant the deal was basically done. So I didn't really have to learn any of that kind of stuff until I had to selling myself, if you know, if that's the way to say it.

Carolene 00:20:28  And so that's kind of how I went into it. but I will say over those three years, I completely lost all my confidence. And it, it it worked. It has been the hardest thing to regain because like I mentioned, I always have been quite a confident person and it's the first time in my life, you know, I at the time I was 36, 37 and I, I had not experienced that that level of, disbelief in myself and lack of confidence. It was it was a very new territory for me. And I even got to the point where I didn't even think the coffee shop down the road would hire me. Like, that's how bad it got from those three years of just being like, you know, like saying cash. I keep saying that. But that's such a it's just the most perfect way to describe, that, that experience. So yeah, going in on a high and then slowly got broken. Broken, broken. Of course. Now on the, on the, the the good side of this whole experience, like I can, I can see all the things that I that that are helping me now and where I wasn't able to make any headway.

Carolene 00:21:39  I feel very clear now. On. On why and how and where I could have done differently, but I didn't know any of that at the time. So I can't have any regrets or anything like that. Right. Because I didn't know. Right? You don't know what?

Jenny 00:21:54  Yeah. No. Looking back, it's it's like so much easier. But when you're in the middle of it, in the thick of it, it's like you're just trying to figure it out and you are scrambling. And so you you go into it and you're confident, and then you start to that starts to decline. And that's the first time in your life that that's really happening. So not only do you have this whole new career path that is brand new and you're paving it, but your own personal emotional stability that you knew yourself with for your whole life is suddenly shifting as well. And one of the things I hear from career flippers around the world is just this the support system that we have, you know, and you brought this up when you reached that point and you asked your parents for help and how much shame you felt for that.

Jenny 00:22:41  And that actually makes a lot of sense, hearing what you say. Like you were the kid, the golden child. Like you had so much potential. You grew up and this is how you knew yourself. So to ask for that help is so hard. And so I'm curious, what was your support system like throughout, you know, this time when it was so incredibly hard for you? And what was the point where you actually felt like, I do have to ask my parents and what was, you know. You said they were very supportive, but what was that conversation like? I know that's a big question, but this is such a pivotal moment of when we ask for help because it's so hard to ask for help. So how did you get that support during that time period?

Carolene 00:23:23  Yeah, I actually became a total recluse, and I was living by myself at the time. And I shut like I it's this sounds quite depressing, but at the time I was thinking, I don't like myself, so I don't want to introduce myself to anyone new.

Carolene 00:23:38  Like I was in a new place and I don't want to reconnect with anyone, you know? I just I didn't want that. And that's obviously quite a faulty belief in hindsight. But that's when you feel that that's how you feel. Right. so I, I actually reached out to start working with a therapist, and that's really what, what kind of got the ball rolling of helping me get out of this rut? I, I have worked with a psychologist or a therapist like, two other times in my life, so I already knew the value of that. But it even took a good, probably 4 or 5 months to even get to that call with, with with her. And I'm still working with her today and that's amazing. And it's amazing. so that was the first thing. And that really helped because this was so emotional and, and touched so many areas of my of who I was as a person, like who I thought I was as a person. And it just. And so it was quite overwhelming.

Carolene 00:24:39  But I was very reclusive. and but in terms of that was like, I can't pay rent. Like I and and they've always been supportive and, you know, they've always been able to, financially support, not crazy amounts, but just like when I needed it, they also, I think the conversation was more. They saw how hard I was working. They it's not like I was sitting here as a total bum. And I was like, can you give me money? Like, it was like, I'm doing everything I can. I'm working all day, every day. And so I think it was that combination of starting to open up after being quite reclusive with a therapist, which was the first step. And then really when I had to, asking my parents, but knowing that they would probably knowing they'd say yes, it's not like I was going into that going, oh gosh. Will they, will they won't they? I knew they would, but it was more of a personal No, I didn't like doing that as a adult.

Jenny 00:25:41  Yeah, yeah, I, I understand that completely. I feel like there's that moment where it's just there, there is shame attached to it. And so once you did ask, what was it like for you when you did get that help? Were you able to like, did it, you know, you're working with a therapist as well, which is so important to take advantage of those resources. Did you find that once you had a little bit more financial stability from your parents, that love you and believe in you and see the work that you're doing? Is that when things started to move upward, or when did things shift to moving more of a upward direction?

Carolene 00:26:21  I have to credit that this next part of my story to the ghostwriting mastermind. I mean, it's changed my life, in every possible, in every amazing possible way. But I actually, it was June, May June 2023. And I was. I went to London to do a workshop, a keynote slash workshop at a summit there, and it was on events and operational design and events.

Carolene 00:26:48  And that's kind of what I was trying to do, consulting in that space. And I went there thinking, this is my last shot. Like, I got to give this, this is my chance. I'm around the people that would potentially hire me. So if something was going to happen, it would be now, like, this is it, you know? And I went there again. Presentation was amazing. Oh my gosh, that was so amazing. This is the same cycle that had been repeated over the last few years, but I wasn't able to have any kind of conversations that would, you know, lead to any anyone wanting to work with me. And so I came home and I thought, right, I'm going to write a book to like, act as, like a lead magnet, right? Like, this is how you do it. And then I'll go do it. So I started writing. I was about ten, 12,000 words in. And one day I just shut the laptop and I was like, I'm done.

Carolene 00:27:39  I'm done talking about experience design. I'm done talking about Cirque du Soleil. Because obviously there was a lot of examples in there about Add Solar Soleil. I was so done, I just so yeah, laptop shot. I still haven't even opened that that Google doc even to this day. So then I was like, oh my gosh, like what now? And it was just a every you know, everything happens in threes, as the saying goes. But in one week I came across someone whose name is Nicholas Cole. He had some. He's like one of the top paid ghostwriters in the world. And, and he has like a book. And then now he has a program with his business partner. And anyway, a couple of, like, things happen all in that same week that led me to him and to this program. I got on a call, a sales call with like the team, and I knew I couldn't afford that at all, but I. I thought, oh gosh, I've got to make this, this is it.

Carolene 00:28:37  This is the thing that I need to do. I feel I just feel it. Yeah. And and that start. Yeah that now I've been there. It's. It'll be two years in in August 2025. and it's. And now I earn the money that I want to earn. I am doing an amazing job and it's it took it was a huge learning curve, obviously, but I got to learn so many skills that I was missing in the last chapter with sales skills, you know, and how to how I'm building my personal brand to attract clients and all these things that I was just winging it at the beginning. But then I found myself in an environment where I could actually ask people who knew what they were talking about and have this constant feedback loop of every week showing up on the clinics and the calls and presenting my work, asking for feedback. And it was just like a night and day difference to the last that, you know, the three years of me, let's say, failing in quotation marks.

Carolene 00:29:37  to, to go through that experience. So being part of that mastermind. You know, not only to learn the educational stuff, but then to actually learn how to be running the business and then also being in a community as well. Changed everything. And I still believe that to this day.

Jenny 00:29:54  Wow. This is this is so amazing. So you are you're, you know, in the solopreneur, era, I'll just call it that. And you are working to build it up. You're consulting and trying to find clients on event planning, and you're at a, an event where you're speaking and you do an amazing workshop and you're like, okay, cool. Like, this is awesome. And then who knew at that moment that you would find that next step into something completely different? And I love this because I feel like this is this is the career flipper. These are the moments that we don't see coming. That and I love how you mentioned that comes in threes too two because they just show up and it's like, oh, I thought I wanted to do this.

Jenny 00:30:38  And, you know, now this is what I'm going to do. And it just intuitively felt so right, like it just felt like the next step. And so I have a couple questions for you on that. First of all, you know, especially on LinkedIn or your social media, there's all these things that pop up about masterminds or programs we can take to learn X, Y, and Z. So my first question for you is, how did you know that this wasn't a scam? And I and I say that with like the most kindness because I just think there are some out there that are but there are some out there that very clearly aren't. So how did you do you have any advice for anyone who might be listening? Like what research did you do to really tune in like that? This was the right program for you?

Carolene 00:31:19  Well, he had a book, I think, and I read that book. Right. This is the guy I want to learn off. So I think if the the the founder is legit, they will have a very strong personal brand and they will probably have assets that are not courses.

Carolene 00:31:34  You know, they'll have other things that really strengthen their their expertise and message. and then it was a feel, I don't know, it was a feeling. And yeah, I totally even at the beginning of the pandemic, I did a a different kind of mastermind and loved it. I just was very lost at the time. So I wasn't able I don't think I was really able to leverage that properly to its real full potential. But it was great. And the guy that ran it was amazing. but I obviously we've all heard the horror stories of of people being scammed. I think that would be the first thing is like, do the people that are running it, like, actually have a legitimate business? Like, have they actually done that or are they just teaching it like it's very different, right. So he he built the first ghostwriting agency in the world as far as he knows. And he's, you know, he became one of the highest paid ghost Ghostwriters and ghostwriting is very interesting because you can't talk about your work.

Carolene 00:32:35  So there's a little bit, I guess, of a jump of faith there as well. But it was a feeling I think once, especially if you're, I say, a little bit older, I'm just about to turn 40. So I hopefully not sold just yet. But yeah, but as you, as you age, I think you're got like the intuition and you're, you're able to make those decisions a lot smarter than maybe if you were, you know, in your early 20s around that, those kind of decisions, especially when there's like a financial element involved. So it was quick though. It happened in a couple days, honestly. And then I was all in.

Jenny 00:33:14  Yeah, yeah. And I think that that's a good point to trusting your your intuition can come with age for sure. Like I totally feel that because there's these things where we see them and they're kind of like shiny objects. Ooh, let's do this. But you had been there. You had hit this really low point and you were learning to trust yourself again, which is what it kind of sounds like as part of your journey.

Jenny 00:33:36  And so you got to this point. I'm just picturing you shutting your laptop and you're like, I'm done. Like I'm done. You knew that you reached the end of that. That point in your chapter, in your wherever this was going, you weren't sure, but you knew this was the end. And so then you saw this next thing come up, and you just you just knew that it was the next best step. And so the point that you also brought up was you saw the price tag and you were like, oh, I can't afford that. So I'm curious because, I mean, I've been there, there are programs out there, like even for podcasting, like I didn't know what I was doing. Maybe I should learn and do it from someone, but I see the price tag and I'm like, I'm literally making $0. I am scraping by. How did you convince yourself to make it worth it to pay that? How did you. I mean, was it intuition? Was there something else like how did you come to terms with being okay with putting that down for the program?

Carolene 00:34:32  I feel like I didn't have a choice.

Carolene 00:34:34  I feel like I had done, I feel like I'd worked my ass off. I'd done everything that I knew how to do to make money for myself and to to to create something that could sustain my, my life and my living. And it didn't work, and I was out of options. And I always know the power of putting up that investment to do something that's really meaningful and impactful and learn from people that are ahead of you like that. Nobody ever has to convince me of that. But like you said, you see the price tag and you're like, so but I didn't I didn't have any choice. That's how I felt about it. I knew I had to do something and this just seemed like a good fit. So I remember the guy on the sales call, like he brought up the credit card page, you know, and and I was I like my heart was like. And I said, yeah, I can't do this right now. I was like, I can give you $1,000 in like two weeks when I had one client at the time doing random things.

Carolene 00:35:36  That was like my only. And I was like, once I get that, I can give you a that and then I'm going to have to do some kind of payment plan if you want me in, like, that's the only thing I can do, so take it or leave it, you know. So I'm very grateful they were accommodating because if they weren't, I would I wouldn't have been able to do it. But that's. Yeah, that's kind of how, how I yeah, I stepped in and I was honest, I was honest with them. Like I was like, I absolutely don't have that, but I can this is my it's like my counter. This is my I'll, you know, not not count, not countering the price or anything, but like how to get to that price point. Like I was like, this is what I can do and manage right now.

Jenny 00:36:15  So yeah, that makes sense. So you jump in and how long was the was the whole program? How long did it take to get up to speed where you were doing your own thing in a new way.

Carolene 00:36:32  Yeah, I mean, I'm still in it today. I'm in, like, the more advanced program. but I made my first, like, money from ghostwriting, probably about four months in, I would say. So I think I classified the first six months as a huge learning curve. Just becoming a student again, you know, just getting ego away a step, putting ego aside and just learning all the things, asking really good questions, showing up and just doing that on repeat for like six months. and then, yeah, kind of got my first client about four weeks in. And then it wasn't until about a couple months ago. So probably over a year end, that I actually found my way back to entertainment. And it was because of some clients that I had in the industry. So we can go more into detail about that. But yeah, that's that's how it started. And I think if you're someone who goes all in then it it happens quite quickly. But you know, everybody today wants it to happen like in two days time.

Carolene 00:37:38  I think you just remove those unrealistic expectations around how quickly things can happen and actually go in with it. I also live in the Mediterranean, so I have a very slow, kind of patient, chill mentality and you can't really rush me to do, to do, to do much at all, which I love. It's a big part of how I live and I think more people should live like that. But yeah. Anyway, so so that was kind of how it began those first six months.

Jenny 00:38:08  Yeah. And that's such a realistic way of looking at things, setting those expectations with yourself. You know, you put in the time, you shifted your mentality back to the student mindset. You're learning, you're absorbing all this new info. And so at this point where is your kind of like mental state because you had been in a really low point. So how are you feeling at this point?

Carolene 00:38:31  I'm very grateful for the calls that they had every week, because they had a couple calls each week and I just showed up.

Carolene 00:38:36  So even if I'd been in bed all day, like super depressed, like I, you know, fixed my hair, got out of like, my sweats and like, got on a call. And that really saved me at the beginning. Like, it really helped me to just have conversation and be around other people because I was still very reclusive in where I was living. And so that was what I think above everything, and feeling like I was progressing and getting closer to earning my first dollars. You know, as a ghostwriter. And those it was like the perfect storm of of all of those different kind of thing learning the expertise, seeing some early results or at least movement, and then being in an environment with people that are at your level or ahead, and then obviously having experts there to to kind of help guide you. I. I think that's the perfect storm of, like, getting out of anything. Really.

Jenny 00:39:28  Yeah. No. Definitely. Definitely. And that accountability and almost like that consistency.

Jenny 00:39:33  I kind of found that for myself too, over time where it's like and I had to kind of create it. But if I am working towards a little bits every day and staying consistent, I was able to see more of that growth and stay. Hold myself accountable. And so when you have others there with you, I feel like that definitely can lift you up a little bit. So you're you're there's forward momentum both professionally and emotionally. And then there's the circle back to the entertainment world. So it sounds like that came from some clients that you, you had. And so where are you at today with everything as far as those clients are you still is it writing in that industry? Where where is it kind of all coming to a head at this point in your path?

Carolene 00:40:22  Yeah. So it was actually one client in particular who reached out to me. It was an inbound request. and at the time, I was kind of like, who can I write for? And anything really like, I'm writing specific assets, but I didn't really have, like a niche or a particular client I was going after.

Carolene 00:40:40  So this was an inbound request. And he is the CEO of like an event tech company. And so, so on our calls and the way ghostwriting works typically is you get on calls with your client and it's almost like an interview like this, like this conversation, and then you turn that conversation into content. So for him in particular, it was LinkedIn, LinkedIn post. And he started obviously talking about events. And that got me so nostalgic. You know, we'd be like, oh yeah, I remember it's like 2 a.m. and in the pouring rain and the forklift and then you're trying to like load something and, you know, and and that it just gave me so much energy and, and made me realize just, I mean, that that's the industry I grew up in professionally as a baby, 20 year old, you know, all the way through to now and really sparked my oh, I want to I want to write for these kind of people. And I and I felt the shift in energy as I was on the call with him and later his co-founder, and I felt it straight away.

Carolene 00:41:39  So that was a I'm always paying attention to signals and trying to make decisions, signal based decisions, not like, just random decisions that I think of in the moment. And so that was a big signal for me. And then I started to just really lean into that. I write for events and entertainment, and then now I'm even more niched down, and I only really write for live entertainment industry executives. So they're in companies. They're not typically founders. And and so it's very, very niche down. And I help them build their personal brands on LinkedIn. And then like I mentioned before, now I'm moving into turning that content into also keynotes as well, because a lot of them would like to speak on stages. They're at that point where they've almost hit the pinnacle in their career. And as a C-suite exec or, you know, there's not many places up they can go. And so now they want to expand outwards. And and what's just so amazing about this circle back around is it's very meaningful for me.

Carolene 00:42:41  Some ghostwriters are getting clients to earn a certain monthly revenue. And it's about that or an industry. But for me it's just been amazing to to I'm now I'm now helping these executives, like, expand their reach beyond their companies. And these are people that I used to not directly work for. But, you know, the roles that they and the companies that they're in, I, you know, I had associations with these kind of companies. And so it almost feels like quite an honor, actually, to be able to to do this with them and to help them spread their message, because I believe in their message so strongly because I come from the industry. So that is such a full circle moment and a moment that I'm really living and thriving in right now. And it just goes to show that you can do the most random things and somehow end up back into something that you're so passionate about, or that you started 20 years ago. For me, you know, it's crazy.

Jenny 00:43:45  Yeah. It's like this reinvention of, you know, what you were doing using those skills.

Jenny 00:43:51  And that is something that comes up a lot with career flippers that I find is there's this golden thread that's always woven through our stories that keeps us connected to to something, and we may not really see it until later. And for you, it sounds like this golden thread, like your time in the event space and the entertainment industry has really helped you throughout your entire career and has helped you make these pivots. And now you're thriving. And so looking back, is there a piece of advice that you would give your younger self about the journey that you are about to embark on based off of what you know now? What would you say?

Carolene 00:44:30  I think I would say that go into every opportunity. First of all, take every opportunity and then go into which is something I never had a problem doing. Like I was always like, yeah, cruise ship. Sure. Why not? I have no idea what that's about, but.

Jenny 00:44:43  Let me.

Carolene 00:44:45  Know. But I think it would be that each opportunity that you go into learn as much as you can, because whether you realize it or not, it will help you in the next one.

Carolene 00:44:55  And it was on the cruise ship that I that I discovered that because the first it was a new cruise ship, or they were refitting a new cruise ship, an old cruise ship, into a new cruise ship. So to me, it was almost like the setup of what we did at Cirque du Soleil when we moved cities each. You know, it was like setting up the operation, and that's what it was. And so at the beginning, I was like, oh my gosh, I have no idea what I'm doing. And I was so like, and I was the leader like of a 50 person team. So it was this, this role was a big job. It wasn't just some random, you know. So I had a lot of pressure on me, but I but each day I just after a couple of weeks I was like, oh my god. Like this is easy for me because of because of Cirque du Soleil. And at that time it was probably six years at Cirque du Soleil.

Carolene 00:45:42  So. And that was such a light bulb moment for me. I distinctly remember this moment where I realized that and I thought, wow, like, you could not have sat and told me like that. I could do the cruise ship thing to the to the level that I was doing it at so quickly. You couldn't have convinced me that that was going to happen until I actually stepped foot on there. And then after I became aware of that pattern, it started showing up again and again and again. And I think I'll be. Yeah, just with that, with that level of awareness, I started to realize that more. So that's really what. Upon reflection, what I would definitely say is each opportunity, even if you think it's the most random thing ever, whatever you learn there will help with the next thing, even if you have no idea what the next thing is until you kind of get there. That's been a pattern in my life, in my work. Well, let's say my working, my professional life that has happened again and again and again, and even this ghostwriting thing is the perfect, perfect example of that to the extreme, I think.

Jenny 00:46:46  Yeah. Oh my gosh. Yeah, absolutely. That just makes so much sense. You just don't know. And these are things we can learn and put in our like you know, toolbox. And then they will show up at other points. One thing leads to another. I always like to think about it like steps. Like if you take this one tiny, tiny, tiny little step, that could be the one step that leads you down a path that, like, eventually becomes so much more than you can ever imagine. And you could learn from it and you could move on from it. And it's like this constant, just like moving of things and using these skills from things that seem so random in the past that now are helping us move forward. And I love that you brought that up, and I love that that is where you're at in your journey. And how can people connect with you? Because this has been such an incredible conversation. Thank you so much for sharing and getting so vulnerable.

Jenny 00:47:39  All of the ups and downs. It's so real. You know, people want to connect with you and ask questions or pick your brain like how can they find you? Where can they find you?

Carolene 00:47:50  Yeah, on LinkedIn, I think I write for my clients on LinkedIn. I write for myself every day on LinkedIn. So that's pretty much where I where I'm hanging out. So it's just my, my full. When you see the spelling of my full name, it's my full name. And yeah, that's where you can find me there. And yeah, I'd be more than happy to answer any questions or have any conversations as a result of this, this conversation. So yes, it's been awesome for me as well. It's always good to talk through your own story and and realize like different connection points. So. Oh, that was actually better than I thought it was because I thought it was a hot friendship. Oh, okay. You know, I yeah. Exercise that a lot of that everyone should do at some point.

Jenny 00:48:30  Yeah. No I love that. I love hearing that. And I hope that career flippers listening and will connect with you and that there's a takeaway from this episode that they can use in their own life because who knows, wherever they are on their path, this might encourage them to take that next step, because you did. So Caroline, thank you so much for being here.

Carolene 00:48:50  Thank you. Yeah, it's been awesome. I've had absolute pleasure. Thank you.

Jenny 00:48:56  Thanks for tuning in to this episode of the Career Flipper podcast. To connect with Caroline, check out the links in the show notes. And hey, if this conversation today made you feel a little less unhinged about your own career change ideas, or maybe you know someone else who is knee deep in that what the heck am I doing with my life? Spiral. Send this episode their way. You never know. It might be exactly what they need to hear right now. If you have a career flip story of your own, I would love to hear it.

Jenny 00:49:28  Head over to the Career flippers to submit your story to be on a future episode. And remember, even if it doesn't look or feel like that much today. Every tiny, tiny step that you're taking counts. You've got this. What's the best that could happen?